Preoccupation with Enculturation

Started by Rev. Christopher Jackson, June 26, 2013, 09:09:27 PM

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LutherMan

Quote from: Team Hesse on June 28, 2013, 10:30:02 AM

Nebraska has always struck me as a "most dense" kind of place..... ;)


Lou
???

James_Gale

Quote from: Dave Likeness on June 28, 2013, 10:06:49 AM
Minnesota has more Lutherans than any other
state in America. 1 out of 5 Adults in Minnesota
are Lutheran.  Lutherans number over 1 million
in the Land of 10,000 Lakes. 

My guess is that the Swedish heritage is greater
than the Norwegian heritage in Minnesota.   Of
course many of the farmers also have a German
lineage.   In many rural areas of the state there is a
Lutheran church every 5 or 6 miles which goes back
to the horse and buggy days.


The Norwegian population in Minnesota is substantially larger than the Swedish population.  (And the German population is bigger than the Norwegian and Swedish populations combined.)


In addition, the Norwegian churches tended to have their headquarters in Minnesota, as did the Norwegian-dominated ALC.  The Augustana Church (the Swedes) had its center of operations in Illinois.  The LCA had its headquarters on the east coast.  Luther Seminary has Norwegian roots.  The Swedes had no seminary in Minnesota.  The Norwegians had three colleges in Minnesota (St. Olaf, Augsburg, and Concordia (Moorhead)) and two just outside the state (Augustana (Sioux Falls) and Luther).  The Swedes had just one (Gustavus Adolphus).


Now, when you suggest that "Swedish heritage" is "greater," I suppose that you might mean qualitatively better.  And if that's the case, I won't argue.

Michael Slusser

Quote from: James_Gale on June 28, 2013, 12:04:27 PM
Quote from: Dave Likeness on June 28, 2013, 10:06:49 AM
Minnesota has more Lutherans than any other
state in America. 1 out of 5 Adults in Minnesota
are Lutheran.  Lutherans number over 1 million
in the Land of 10,000 Lakes. 

My guess is that the Swedish heritage is greater
than the Norwegian heritage in Minnesota.   Of
course many of the farmers also have a German
lineage.   In many rural areas of the state there is a
Lutheran church every 5 or 6 miles which goes back
to the horse and buggy days.
The Norwegian population in Minnesota is substantially larger than the Swedish population.  (And the German population is bigger than the Norwegian and Swedish populations combined.)

In addition, the Norwegian churches tended to have their headquarters in Minnesota, as did the Norwegian-dominated ALC.  The Augustana Church (the Swedes) had its center of operations in Illinois.  The LCA had its headquarters on the east coast.  Luther Seminary has Norwegian roots.  The Swedes had no seminary in Minnesota.  The Norwegians had three colleges in Minnesota (St. Olaf, Augsburg, and Concordia (Moorhead)) and two just outside the state (Augustana (Sioux Falls) and Luther).  The Swedes had just one (Gustavus Adolphus).

From the Luther Seminary website:
Luther Seminary, through a series of mergers covering more than half a century, represents the consolidation into one seminary of what at one time were six separate institutions.

The oldest of the antecedent institutions was Augsburg Theological Seminary, founded in 1869 at Marshall, Wis., as the seminary of the Lutheran Free Church. It remained a separate seminary until 1963 when the Lutheran Free Church merged with the American Lutheran Church and Augsburg Seminary was united with Luther Seminary in St. Paul.
Initial Merger in 1917

Luther Theological Seminary was initially formed through the merger of three institutions in 1917 in conjunction with the merger of three Norwegian Lutheran Churches. Each of the three churches operated a seminary: the Norwegian Synod operated Luther Seminary, located near Hamline Ave. in St. Paul; the Hauge Synod operated Red Wing Seminary in Red Wing, Minn.; and the United Norwegian Lutheran Church operated the United Church Seminary on a portion of the present site of Luther Seminary in St. Paul. The merged seminaries occupied the site of the United Church Seminary on Como Ave. and Luther Place, and retained the name of the oldest of the three schools, namely, Luther Theological Seminary, which had been founded in 1876.

When Luther Theological Seminary was united with Augsburg Seminary in 1963, Luther, through the process of merger, assumed the earlier founding date of 1869.

Northwestern Lutheran Theological Seminary traces its origin to the Chicago Lutheran Divinity School, begun in Chicago in 1920 following action taken by the English Evangelical Lutheran Synod of the Northwest, a synod of the United Lutheran Church in America. In 1921, the seminary was moved to Fargo, N.D., and the following year to Minneapolis. From 1921 to 1982, its name was Northwestern Lutheran Theological Seminary. Located in north Minneapolis from 1922 to 1940 and in the former Pillsbury mansion in south Minneapolis for the next 27 years, it moved to the campus of Luther Theological Seminary in 1967.

At the time of the formation of the Lutheran Church in America in 1962, Northwestern Lutheran Theological Seminary was placed under the jurisdiction of two supporting synods: the Minnesota Synod and the Red River Valley Synod.
Luther and Northwestern

Desiring to make a witness to their common faith, Luther and Northwestern Seminaries functionally unified in 1976, beginning with a single administration


It's the kind of history I try to recall when I'm tempted to imagine that our churches are doing something that will last.

Peace,
Michael
Fr. Michael Slusser
Retired Roman Catholic priest and theologian

James_Gale

Quote from: Michael Slusser on June 28, 2013, 01:12:54 PM
Quote from: James_Gale on June 28, 2013, 12:04:27 PM
Quote from: Dave Likeness on June 28, 2013, 10:06:49 AM
Minnesota has more Lutherans than any other
state in America. 1 out of 5 Adults in Minnesota
are Lutheran.  Lutherans number over 1 million
in the Land of 10,000 Lakes. 

My guess is that the Swedish heritage is greater
than the Norwegian heritage in Minnesota.   Of
course many of the farmers also have a German
lineage.   In many rural areas of the state there is a
Lutheran church every 5 or 6 miles which goes back
to the horse and buggy days.
The Norwegian population in Minnesota is substantially larger than the Swedish population.  (And the German population is bigger than the Norwegian and Swedish populations combined.)

In addition, the Norwegian churches tended to have their headquarters in Minnesota, as did the Norwegian-dominated ALC.  The Augustana Church (the Swedes) had its center of operations in Illinois.  The LCA had its headquarters on the east coast.  Luther Seminary has Norwegian roots.  The Swedes had no seminary in Minnesota.  The Norwegians had three colleges in Minnesota (St. Olaf, Augsburg, and Concordia (Moorhead)) and two just outside the state (Augustana (Sioux Falls) and Luther).  The Swedes had just one (Gustavus Adolphus).

From the Luther Seminary website:
Luther Seminary, through a series of mergers covering more than half a century, represents the consolidation into one seminary of what at one time were six separate institutions.

The oldest of the antecedent institutions was Augsburg Theological Seminary, founded in 1869 at Marshall, Wis., as the seminary of the Lutheran Free Church. It remained a separate seminary until 1963 when the Lutheran Free Church merged with the American Lutheran Church and Augsburg Seminary was united with Luther Seminary in St. Paul.
Initial Merger in 1917

Luther Theological Seminary was initially formed through the merger of three institutions in 1917 in conjunction with the merger of three Norwegian Lutheran Churches. Each of the three churches operated a seminary: the Norwegian Synod operated Luther Seminary, located near Hamline Ave. in St. Paul; the Hauge Synod operated Red Wing Seminary in Red Wing, Minn.; and the United Norwegian Lutheran Church operated the United Church Seminary on a portion of the present site of Luther Seminary in St. Paul. The merged seminaries occupied the site of the United Church Seminary on Como Ave. and Luther Place, and retained the name of the oldest of the three schools, namely, Luther Theological Seminary, which had been founded in 1876.

When Luther Theological Seminary was united with Augsburg Seminary in 1963, Luther, through the process of merger, assumed the earlier founding date of 1869.

Northwestern Lutheran Theological Seminary traces its origin to the Chicago Lutheran Divinity School, begun in Chicago in 1920 following action taken by the English Evangelical Lutheran Synod of the Northwest, a synod of the United Lutheran Church in America. In 1921, the seminary was moved to Fargo, N.D., and the following year to Minneapolis. From 1921 to 1982, its name was Northwestern Lutheran Theological Seminary. Located in north Minneapolis from 1922 to 1940 and in the former Pillsbury mansion in south Minneapolis for the next 27 years, it moved to the campus of Luther Theological Seminary in 1967.

At the time of the formation of the Lutheran Church in America in 1962, Northwestern Lutheran Theological Seminary was placed under the jurisdiction of two supporting synods: the Minnesota Synod and the Red River Valley Synod.
Luther and Northwestern

Desiring to make a witness to their common faith, Luther and Northwestern Seminaries functionally unified in 1976, beginning with a single administration


It's the kind of history I try to recall when I'm tempted to imagine that our churches are doing something that will last.

Peace,
Michael


It certainly is complex.  And sadly, the seminary today is struggling mightily to right itself financially.


The seminary lived through the tumultuous history within Norwegian Lutheranism.  While the Swedes remained relatively united within the Augustana Synod (and did not merge with others until the creation of the LCA in the early 1960s), the Norwegians were constantly merging, splitting, suing, etc.  The only thing that united them, I think, was a shared suspicion of the uppity Swedes.  And I'm only kind of kidding.

George Erdner

Quote from: Dave Likeness on June 28, 2013, 10:06:49 AM
Minnesota has more Lutherans than any other
state in America. 1 out of 5 Adults in Minnesota
are Lutheran.  Lutherans number over 1 million
in the Land of 10,000 Lakes. 

My guess is that the Swedish heritage is greater
than the Norwegian heritage in Minnesota.   Of
course many of the farmers also have a German
lineage.   In many rural areas of the state there is a
Lutheran church every 5 or 6 miles which goes back
to the horse and buggy days.


Considering that most folks with Scandanavian or German ancestry are 4th, 5th, and 6th generations removed from their original immigrant ancestors, finding anyone who doesn't have a mix of all of the above in their gene pool is pretty much slim and none. As for cultural identity, most of them think that the Vikings are just a football team, and only know about Sweden as the home of Volvos, Ikea, and bikini-clad blondes.


James_Gale

Quote from: George Erdner on June 28, 2013, 04:15:59 PM
Quote from: Dave Likeness on June 28, 2013, 10:06:49 AM
Minnesota has more Lutherans than any other
state in America. 1 out of 5 Adults in Minnesota
are Lutheran.  Lutherans number over 1 million
in the Land of 10,000 Lakes. 

My guess is that the Swedish heritage is greater
than the Norwegian heritage in Minnesota.   Of
course many of the farmers also have a German
lineage.   In many rural areas of the state there is a
Lutheran church every 5 or 6 miles which goes back
to the horse and buggy days.


Considering that most folks with Scandanavian or German ancestry are 4th, 5th, and 6th generations removed from their original immigrant ancestors, finding anyone who doesn't have a mix of all of the above in their gene pool is pretty much slim and none. As for cultural identity, most of them think that the Vikings are just a football team, and only know about Sweden as the home of Volvos, Ikea, and bikini-clad blondes.
You've obviously not lived in Minnesota.

Norman Teigen

It's nice to see so many comments about Minnesota. 
Norman Teigen

Charles_Austin

I'm second generation pure Swede and if anyone thinks of Swedish women in bikinis they are idiots about the climate in Sweden or Minnesota.

Dave Likeness

My grandfather George Likeness at the age of 18
came to America on a boat from Norway in 1902.
He passed through Ellis Island in New York and
became an American citizen.  He already had a
trade as a baker and moved to the Midwest.

As a second generation Norwegian I am proud
of my heritage. My grandparents were married
in 1905 in an LCMS church since it was the closest
Lutheran parish to their house.

George Erdner

Well, I guess two whole people who had relatively late-arriving ancestors and who are themselves a bit on the older side totally proves that most people alive today aren't 4rd, 5th, or 6th generation.

LutherMan

http://www.lcms.org/page.aspx?pid=1257
How can we as Lutherans live in but not succumb to the culture?

Christians these days talk a lot about "culture wars," "cultural engagement," and "cultural ministry." So it's important to realize that Lutherans have an approach to culture and to cultural issues that is quite different from that of other theologies.

Lutherans believe in the doctrine of the two kingdoms. God reigns in His spiritual kingdom, which He establishes by His Word and Sacraments, consisting of everyone who has faith in Jesus Christ. This kingdom, often called the kingdom of God's right hand, indicating its special favor with God, will last forever in the eternal life that He has prepared for His children.

But God has another kingdom. He also reigns in the world He created and in the human societies that He has ordained. God rules this kingdom by His laws, both the natural lawsthat He built into the universe and the moral laws that He inscribed onto the human heart. Thus, He providentially governs the physical world—to the point of caring for each sparrow that falls to the ground (Matt. 10:29)—and also human societies. He gives food for the animals of the wild (Psalm 104), and He also gives daily provisions for Christian and non-Christian alike (Matt. 5:45). Furthermore, God established human institutions, such as marriage and parenthood, in the estate of the family (Gen. 2:18–25) and the estate of earthly governments (Romans 13).

God also governs His temporal kingdom by working through human beings, that is, through vocation. (Technically, only Christians have vocations—callings from God—since only Christians have been called by the Gospel, but God also works similarly through non-believers in their various offices and stations in life.) God feeds us through farmers, protects us through police officers and heals us through doctors. He calls us to love and serve our neighbors in the estates that He ordained: the household (including the family and the work families do to support themselves), the church (pastors, laypeople) and the state (rulers, subjects and citizens).

A Lutheran approach to culture

First of all, God already rules in the secular world. It isn't a matter, as some Christians say, of winning the world for Christ or bringing the country under God's law or Christianizing the culture. God already reigns in the culture. He governs even those who do not know Him. He is present—but hidden—in the world and in all of His creation, sustaining all of existence and taking care of believers and non-believers alike.

Second, Christians are citizens of both kingdoms. They have an eternal citizenship in God's spiritual kingdom. But God also assigns Christians vocations, where they are to live out their faith in the world (1 Cor. 7:17). Christians have families, jobs and citizenship, each of which is an arena for loving and serving their neighbors.
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