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Messages - Jeremy_Loesch

Thank you Aletheist for your words there.  Please, Mr. Mundinger, read those words.  Without error and inerrant mean the same thing in the same way that six and half a dozen mean the same thing in the same way that Michael Jordan and Greatest of All Time mean the same thing. 

I would like to agree with you that inspiration does not mean dictation, and that was not how the word/concept was taught in my school days and I'm confident it is not taught that way today.  Inspiration is also not glossigraphia, where the author put his pen on the scroll/parchment/paper and waited for the Holy Spirit to move that pen and form words.  St. Luke carefully investigated and listened to what was told him about the life of Jesus and the acts of the apostles, and he was inspired to write Luke and Acts and his books are inerrant, they are without error.  His books served as great 'amicus briefs' for St. Paul's trial in Rome. 

The Bible is inerrant, is without error, because it is the Word of God.  Several pages ago Rolf Preus gave the good Word that Jesus will be with us into the ages of ages.  Then Brian shared all the times from St. John's gospel where Jesus told the disciples that He was about to go away.  I am late in thanking Brian for showing us the truth of the Bible that Jesus was preparing to ascend into heaven in order to be with His people today and into the ages of ages.  Jesus did go away in order that the Holy Spirit may proceed from both the Father and the Son, in order that the Holy Spirit may perform the job given Him by the Father- that the Spirit may bring to our mind all that Jesus did and all that Jesus said.  No conflict.  No error.  Completely inerrant for it is the Word of God for His people to receive and believe.

Quote from: Rob Morris on June 10, 2024, 11:21:46 AMChorus number 4857 of "Not a precious jewel, just a rock."

Don't you get tired of this refrain? Why is it such a life mission for you to make sure people don't trust their Bibles too much? Why do you delight so greatly in finding alternate readings that could undermine ancient understandings ("parthenos" sometimes meant "widows" so Isaiah [which was written in Hebrew, but whatever] could have meant "unmarried but not virgin")?

I have guesses as to the cause, but what are your self-reflections?

Sophists delight in the appearance of wisdom.  Sophists aren't really interested in the topic as long as they can show that they have the appearance of wisdom, intellect, smarts, knowledge. 

Mary was an unmarried woman.  Oh, she was a virgin.  Got it. 

I have been trying to follow this discussion.  When it comes to whether Scripture is inerrant or without error, the answer is yes.  They are.  Inerrant means without error.  Without error means inerrant.  They are synonymous terms. 

I asked for six garlic knots at the restaurant the other day and they gave me half a dozen.  How dare they!
I asked for a three foot by three foot sheet of plywood at Home Depot for a project.  They brought me a sheet of plywood that measured one yard by one yard.  Unbelievable. 

Holy Scripture is inerrant.
Holy Scripture is without error.

What does that mean?  It means what I just wrote. 

Your Turn / Re: White Privilege and Caitlin Clark
June 04, 2024, 12:38:03 PM
Quote from: John Mundinger on June 04, 2024, 11:29:02 AM
Quote from: Jeremy_Loesch on June 04, 2024, 11:12:27 AMSo again, what does access to information have to do with sponsorships from gambling?  The fact that there are moneylines on the crawl of Good Morning Football on the NFL Network brought to you by DraftKings? 

In the real world, everything is connected to everything else.  I'd suggest that the popularity of pro sports and sports related programming is driven at least as much by gambling as by fans' interest in their teams.  Regardless of the reasons for the audience, the size of the audience influences advertising revenue.

Btw, have you every consider tuning into a different station?  Currently, I'm listening to Performance Today.  Great music. ;)

Oh I do listen to other things- On spotify I have made playlists for a grunge channel, Foo Fighters, John Prine, Iris Dement, the Avett Bros, Metallica, Jimmy Buffet, John Denver, Rush, Queen, Johnny Cash, have made playlists of Trinity hymns, Baptism hymns, Communion hymns.  I listen to Lutheran Public Radio.  A friend has introduced me to Colter Wall who is just phenomenal.  His voice alone could smoke a brisket.  This is his song Kate MacCannon:  The moral of the story is to never marry the prettiest girl in the whole darn holler. 

My consumption of sports radio can only go so long.  It does increase when the Chiefs regular season is going on.

Your Turn / Re: White Privilege and Caitlin Clark
June 04, 2024, 11:24:09 AM
Quote from: Dave Benke on June 04, 2024, 10:56:41 AMThe sports gambling plague has really gone off the rails and is totally connected to data, including the same data mined for say managing a baseball game or pitching to a certain hitter.  I don't know how they can be disassociated.  Big bucks in all directions.

WRT Caitlin Clark, if and as her teammates protect her along the way this year, a lot of the rancor will move down the highway.  That, and adding another couple of top players, at least one.  Work in progress.

Dave Benke

Excellent point about the Indiana Fever supporting Caitlin Clark.  No one ever touched Wayne Gretzky or Brett Hull because the teams had enforcers on the roster.  For the Blues it was Tony Twist and Kelly Chase.  They played scant minutes but if someone on the other team took liberties with the Golden Brett or tried to take liberties with him, Tony Twist stepped on the ice to play left wing and knock the offender on the opposing team senseless if that player wasn't a chicken.  Sometimes they'd fight, sometimes they wouldn't.  The enforcers kept the game clean.  Players can enforce their own game to an extent. 

Your Turn / Re: White Privilege and Caitlin Clark
June 04, 2024, 11:12:27 AM
I know there are gambling lines with every game.  And according to the radio show I am listening to at this very minute "New Day with SSJ (Steven St. John)" on WHB 810, a San Diego MLB player named Marcano has been banned for life because of gambling on baseball.  SSJ just said, "Get used to it people."  Jontay Porter, former Mizzou Tiger and former Denver Nugget, has been banned for life from the NBA due to gambling. 

The leagues/associations have let gambling in.  They have to address it, police it, enforce the rules.  Gamble all you want on other leagues, just not on ours.  If you gamble on our games, you're out.  Pete Rose isn't banned permanently for gambling; he's banned permanently (and may it ever be) for gambling on baseball and gambling on games he was managing. 

So again, what does access to information have to do with sponsorships from gambling?  The fact that there are moneylines on the crawl of Good Morning Football on the NFL Network brought to you by DraftKings? 

In the halcyon days of my youth, I spent just about every summer night at Municipal Stadium in Hagerstown MD 'working' for the Carolina League Hagerstown Suns, the A ball affiliate of the Bal'mer Orioles.  I'd crawl on the top of the covered grandstands to fetch foul balls so they could be returned to play, I'd fetch food and drinks for the radio guy and the official scorer, I'd take food and drinks to the players in the bullpen.  My pay was autographs, cracked bats, a hot dog and a coke.  The outfield fence had advertisements for Budweiser, Busch, Miller Lite, ads for Winston, Newports, and a giant Marlboro man.  A local tobacco shop advertised on the fence.  The program had tobacco and alcohol ads in it.  Is that better or worse than Fanduel or DraftKings?  I don't know.  I do know that I find an ice cold Busch Light and a smoke far more enjoyable than deciphering what it means that the Cardinals are +125 against the Astros.     

Your Turn / Re: White Privilege and Caitlin Clark
June 04, 2024, 10:22:49 AM
Driven by gambling?  Like in a 2000 Buick Century Custom?   ;D

Probably a lot.  Fanduel, MGM, and a few others a major sponsors, and in a cliche that crosslists with many other aspects of life: "He who pays the piper calls the tune."  All the NFL pregrame shows have fantasy segments and the betting line and over/under and other factors are prevalent.  And that goes into the MLB, NBA, and NHL as well.  It's probably even in golf, tennis, and I know it is college football and men's college basketball. 

Gambling is prevalent.  But access to sports information?  Maybe I don't follow your agenda?  From my office I listen to WHB 810 sports radio in Kansas City through the internet.  Right now there is a Home Depot commercial.  Before that was a commercial for a marijuana dispensary that has a permit to deliver to both KS and MO.  And I'm waiting for the commercial that will help guys get their game back in the bedroom.  I don't shop at Home Depot.  I've never been to a dispensary.  And I'm not interested in getting my game back because how can one get back what one never possessed in the first place?  The enticements to gamble?  They don't interest me either.  I don't really care about what Fanduel or MGM offers.  It's not marketed to me.  I'm not the target audience.  I have no money.  I have some knowledge of the over/under but really have no knowledge of betting lines.  And I know that I have a tendency toward addictive behaviors (I'm all in on bass fishing until I'm not.  I'm all in on eating ice cream until I'm not, on craft beers, on composting and organic gardening, on reading books by a certain author, until I'm not.)

There was plenty of access to information before gambling got involved.  Things have really involved in sports media.  Baseball, football, hockey, basketball, and soccer all have their own media networks.  MLB Network and NFL Network, etc.  They existed before Barstool Sports was a thing.  Gambling was under the surface.  I perceive that now it is above the surface. 

The leagues need to police gambling a little more- determining where, when, and on what sports players gamble on.  Gambling at the team facility on other games in our league?  No.  Gambling at home on games in other leagues?  May the odds be ever in your favor.  And call 1-800-quitter if you get in trouble. 

Access to sports information is driven by money.  And there was plenty of that even before gambling was brought on as a partner.  I think I have all the access I want without being involved in gambling. 

Does that answer some of the question?  What do you mean by access to sports information?

Your Turn / Re: White Privilege and Caitlin Clark
June 04, 2024, 09:14:34 AM
Everyone in the WNBA should be kissing Caitlin Clark's feet and statues should be erected in her honor already.  She has brought attention to the WNBA like no one has ever done- not Lisa Leslie, Sue Bird, Cheryl Swoopes, Diana Taurasi, Elena Della Donne, and every other WNBA player previously.  If they don't like the attention she receives, maybe they'll like flying coach on Frontier Airlines?  Maybe they'll like playing in front of no one?  Before she arrived no one really gave a darn about the WNBA.  For a long time in college if you weren't a hard core fan of Pat Summit or Geno Auriemma and their teams, women's college basketball was space filler until the men's games came on.  It has gotten a little more popular since Pat Summit died and it is no longer just UT and UConn that dominate things so more schools can compete. 

At her next press conference I really hope that Caitlin Clark tells her sisters in the WNBA: Go get yer effin shine box!

Your Turn / Re: White Privilege and Caitlin Clark
June 04, 2024, 09:07:25 AM
I don't have cable or a streaming service and it is extremely easy to be a professional sports fan.  You can watch fifteenish minute highlights of games.  You see the important things and miss the boring parts.  There are so many podcasts that can keep you informed.  You can listen to sports talk radio to stay informed.  And when it comes to football, Fox, CBS, NBC, and ABC all broadcast games.  ABC broadcasts in the home market when ESPN has the Monday Night Football telecast.  Amazon Prime does the Thursday night game, so that would be the only thing you miss out on. 

Dr. Reed Lessing is leading a workshop in Fargo ND July 15-17 on Genesis "In the Beginning". It will be a workshop on creation. Visit for more information, how to register. I bet it will be very valuable.

And if you catch him during the break, he'd also be the person to set matters straight on the whole 2nd and 3rd Isaiah stuff and on Paul's writing of the pastoral letters.  ;D. Dr. Lessing is a good delegate, not interested in word games.

Your Turn / Re: Women in Ministry
May 26, 2024, 08:08:53 PM
Second and Third Isaiah is a joke. All legitimate scholars agree that Paul wrote Isaiah, but this is a different Paul than the one who wrote Seventh Revelations and the Gospel of Markthew, which provides much of the foundation for the Ever Blessed, Perpetual Virgin Mary's letter to the Ephesians.

Isaiah wrote First Isaiah. Isaiah also wrote Second Isiah. And finally, Isaiah wrote Third Isaiah. Or simply, Isaiah  wrote Isaiah.

I've done a few quasi-destination weddings- one in central MD where the couple and I were able to do what we wished with the space.  And it was an old chapel that had been preserved (and modernized with electicity, running water).  There was a harpist who did the music and accompanied me while I sang the Lord's Prayer.  It was nice.  The other destination wedding was in Bentonville AR.  The bride had attended the Univ of Arkansas in Fayetteville and this space was really lovely.  It was just a space and we were able to dress up the table as we needed.  The mother of the bride made a lovely table cross out of wood that we placed on the table.  She also made some green paraments for the table so we made it look like a lovely altar.

When called on by a funeral home to do an 'emergency' service, I most always do so.  My #1 question is, "Was the deceased baptized?"  If the answer is yes, I go from there.  I figure the family is in need and is reaching out for someone/something.  I do look at it as an opportunity to preach a meat and potatoes Law/Gospel sermon and to bring the comfort of God's Church to the situation. 

And in something that I wrote for FL a long time ago, a funeral home called me because a Navy vet was living in San Diego but was going to be buried at a cemetery in Delaware and asked if I would conduct the committal.  I said I could and I would.  On the day of I was the only person there aside from the cemetery workers.  The committal service was a dialogue with myself, though the three cemetery workers prayed the Lord's Prayer with me.  And when the service was concluded the workers told me I could go but I stayed until all the work was done.  I think this man died alone, had outlived his siblings, and I had no idea about a spouse or children or whatnot.  I stayed and made sure that he was planted under the watchful eye of an undershepherd.


Your Turn / Re: "Plain" Reading of Scripture
May 16, 2024, 09:52:30 PM
Quote from: John Mundinger on May 16, 2024, 03:00:58 PM
Quote from: Jeremy_Loesch on May 16, 2024, 02:47:24 PMPeter's analogy works perfectly fine because it perfectly describes how Brian interacts here when he tries to explain God's Word. As Peter said, you just don't like it.


I don't like it for at least three reasons:
1.  It is trivial, relative to the topic.
2.  It presupposes that the coach knows the game better than the quarterback.  That might be correct in football.  But, in this case, it only serves to reveal Pr. Speckard's and, apparently, your bias.  In conversations, we might be able to learn from one another.  But "Scripture says..." is not really an objective standard for resolving differences because, as these conversations demonstrate, "Scripture says..." is really "my hermeneutic says..."
3.  There is a problem with the Eighth.

If I'm allowed to not agree, then I disagree. Peter explains it very well in the following post. It has nothing to do with any particular hermeneutic, exegesis, or eisegesis. And I don't believe it has anything to do with 8th anymore than it has to do with the 10th, 9th, 7th, 6th, 5th, 4th, 3rd, 2nd, or 1st. I'm surprised you didn't bring in Matthew 18.

Peter has been interacting with Brian for a long time, and I have been mainly an observer since 2007 or 2008. IMO, Peter knows how Brian treats the Word, and that treatment is something different than what has been handed down. At times Brian is overly literalistic with the Word and at other times his treatment of a particular passage has no connection to that particular passage.

Brian is very knowledgeable about the Word, has studied it for a long time, has the commentaries and followers to prove whatever he wants to prove. I just consider him to be a sophist.

Your not understanding the analogy that Peter laid out is because you don't want to understand it.

Your Turn / Re: "Plain" Reading of Scripture
May 16, 2024, 02:47:24 PM
Peter's analogy works perfectly fine because it perfectly describes how Brian interacts here when he tries to explain God's Word. As Peter said, you just don't like it.

Nice.  Thank you!

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